Collector's Corner..On Dedicated Chess Computers...

[Steve B]

Up next in the Saitek Mid sized wooden board category is the Stratos:




There are some minor differences between the Corona and Stratos boards in addition to the auto sensory/Pressure sensory difference

an amusing one is the manner in which the Stratos indicates Nodes per second

the Corona shows the node count in the normal numerical display of xxxx

while the Stratos does so in Exponential notation
so for example a node count of 2000 appears in the display as 10^3 ... 2
or 50000 as 10^4....5
the only computer i can think of that displays nodes this way

having lost the last game to the greatly lower rated Corona i gave the Citrine the white pieces for this game against the Stratos

in the game thankfully the Citrine was not out booked and left book at move 12

[White "Novag Citrine"]
[Black "Saitek Stratos"]
[Time Control "Game 30Min"]


1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O Be7 6.Re1 b5 7.Bb3 O-O 8.c3
d6 9.h3 Bb7 10.d4 Re8 11.Nbd2 Bf8




the Citrine is now out of book with a reasonable PV of +.16 .Stratos views the position as -.01



12.a4 Qd7 13.Ng5 d5 14.exd5 Na5
15.dxe5 Nxb3 16.Qxb3 h6 17.Ngf3 Nxd5 18.axb5 axb5 19.Rxa8 Rxa8 20.c4 Nb4
21.e6 fxe6 22.cxb5 Bd5 23.Qc3 Bd6 24.Nd4 Na2 25.Qe3 e5 26.Nc6 Bxc6
27.bxc6 Qxc6 28.Ne4 Nxc1 29.Rxc1 Qb5 30.Qd2 Kh8 31.b3 Qb6 32.Qc2 Qb4
33.Rd1 Ra3 34.Qc4 Qxb3 35.Qxb3 Rxb3 36.Nxd6 cxd6 37.Rxd6 Rb1+ 38.Kh2 Rb2
39.Kg3 Rb3+ 40.Kg4 Rb2 41.Kf3 Rb3+ 42.Ke4 Rb2 43.Ke3 Rb3+
44.Rd3


[fen]7k/6p1/7p/4p3/8/1r1RK2P/5PP1/8 w - - 0 44[/fen]

the game is drawn ..interestingly the Stratos sets in for a long 2 minute think here possibly considering what an exchange of rooks would bring in ..
its PV shows +.63 but it elects to not exchange ...


44..Rb2 45.Rd7 Rb3+ 46.Ke4 Rb2 47.Kf3 Rb3+ 48.Ke2 Rb2+ 49.Ke1 Kh7 50.Re7 Rb5
51.Kd2 Kg6 52.Ra7 Rb1 53.Ke3 1/2-1/2

FINAL POSITION

[fen]8/R5p1/6kp/4p3/8/4K2P/5PP1/1r6 w - - 0 53[/fen]

DRAWN

both computers were showing PV's of less then .3
so i called it a day

as both the Stratos and Corona are far weaker in Elo then the Citrine the score of .5-1.5 is nothing for the Citrine to be proud of

the next and final game against the Saitek mid-sized wooden boards features the President
a much stronger opponent then either the Stratos and Corona and with the Citrine having the Black Pieces...

this could get...
Ugly Regards
Steve

[Wardy]

Excellent stuff Steve,

At the time I was bought my Prisma I dreamt of owning a Corona, good to see it's still none to shabby

Aspirational regards

Paul

[Steve B]

The Saitek President boasts a completely wooden board unlike the Stratos and Corona who have plastic playing surfaces surrounded by a thick wooden border

in several respects it is quite similar to the Citrine in that they are both totally wooden ,auto sensory's with an led on each square and both have a detachable display module which is not needed for game play
the Citrine however allows the user to access all of the computers features and options without the display module while in the President the module is needed to access all of the options

Sporting an elo of just under 2000(SS) the President was handed the White pieces and came ready to play..



In the Game the President and Citrine were fairly close in search depths with both hitting 7-8 ply . node counts were higher for the Citrine reaching about 4000 while the President managed about 3300 on Avg.

the Citrine's small 12k book reared its ugly head again abandoning the hapless computer once again at move three but unlike the debacle against the Corona it was not down any material at that point and it came out of book with a +.33 PV

[White "Saitek President"]
[Black "Novag Citrine"]
[Time Control "Game 30min"]


1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 Bxc3+ 5.bxc3 d6 6.Nf3 O-O 7.Bd3 Bd7
8.O-O Bc6 9.Ba3 Nbd7 10.Rb1 Ne4 11.Qc2 Ndf6 12.Rb3 a6 13.Rfb1 Rb8 14.c5
d5 15.Qc1 Nd7 16.c4 f6 17.cxd5 exd5 18.Nd2 Nxd2 19.Qxd2 Re8
20.Bb2 Re7 21.Ba1 Ra8 22.a3 Kh8 23.R1b2

[fen]r2q3k/1ppnr1pp/p1b2p2/2Pp4/3P4/PR1BP3/1R1Q1PPP/B5K1 w - - 0 23[/fen]
A Rather bizarre position with Whites Bishop buried in on the first rank by its own pieces
the bishop will not move again until the game had already been decided
that however does not bother the President who evaluates its position here as +1.01 while the Citrine clocks in at -.08



23..Qc8 24.Bf5 g6 25.Bg4 Qd8 26.Bf3
Qc8 27.Rb4 a5 28.R4b3 Qg8 29.Rb1 a4 30.R3b2 Rae8 31.Bd1 Ra8 32.Rb4 Qe6
33.Bc2 Ree8 34.R1b2 Qf7 35.Qd3 f5 36.Qc3 Nf6 37.Rb1 h6 38.Qd3 Ne4
39.R4b2 Kg7 40.f3 Nf6 41.Rb4 Qe6 42.Re1 Qf7 43.Qc3 Qd7 44.e4

[fen]r3r3/1ppq2k1/2b2npp/2Pp1p2/pR1PP3/P1Q2P2/2B3PP/B3R1K1 w - - 0 44[/fen]
with the material even and the game slipping into a draw the President embarks on a series of aggressive exchanges beginning with this pawn thrust

44.. fxe4 45.fxe4 Nxe4 ??
[fen]r3r3/1ppq2k1/2b3pp/2Pp4/pR1Pn3/P1Q5/2B3PP/B3R1K1 w - - 0 46[/fen]
in what can only be described as the worst blunder by a dedicated chess computer in the new Millennium, the Citrine blunders away a whole piece
not even short of time and responding instantly because of a ponder hit it misses Whites 48th move ..only 5 ply away

46.Bxe4 Rxe4 47.Rxe4 dxe4 48.d5+

[fen]r7/1ppq2k1/2b3pp/2PP4/pR2p3/P1Q5/6PP/B5K1 w - - 0 48[/fen]
the sting at the end of the serpent's tail
Blacks bishop is lost and with it.. the game

48.. Kh7 49.dxc6 bxc6 50.Rxe4
Rf8 51.h4 Qd1+ 52.Kh2 Qd7 53.Rxa4 g5 54.Rd4 Qf7 55.a4 Re8 56.a5 gxh4
57.Qd3+ Kg8 58.Rg4+ Kf8 59.Bg7+ Qxg7 60.Rxg7 Kxg7 61.Qd7+ Kf8 62.Qxc6
Kf7 63.a6 Ke7 64.a7 Rc8 65.a8=Q Rxa8 66.Qxa8

FINAL POSITION
[fen]Q7/2p1k3/7p/2P5/7p/8/6PK/8 w - - 0 66[/fen]
i ended it here

Only one draw(with White) from Three games for the Citrine against weaker opposition
an abysmal showing,however the Citrine is still a very beautiful wooden board and of course these few games mean nothing
not to mention the fact that the Citrine seems to already be SOLDOUT Worldwide..making it an instant Collectors Item

Saitek Small Wooden Boards Up Next Regards

Steve

[Steve B]

Not all testing is fun and games
nay,sometimes hard, analytical work is needed to resolve conflicts of information or even lack of information

such was the case with the Three Smaller wooden boards Saitek released for sale

the first smaller wooden board was the Astral programmed by Julio Kaplan , released in 1986 and running on a 6301 processor with a rating of 1526 (SS):



so far so good ...however.. all was not to be so calm and quiet as we shall soon see..


the next smaller wooden board Saitek released was the Virtuoso in 1992 running on the H8 processor and with the manual indicating a 16 Mhz clock speed:



the last of the smaller wooden boards was the Capella released in 1998 and rated 1850(SS):





now it is believed by collectors worldwide that the Capella and Virtuoso are identical computers(even though released 6 years apart ) with only some small cosmetic differences .same program ,,and hardware and both programmed by Frans Morsch

however and herein was the problem..the Capella's manual indicated a clock speed of 10 Mhz!


it was bad enough that Saitek released virtually the same exact computer 6 years later but at a lower clock speed??

this was too much even for a hard core collector like me to believe so i set about testing this to see if it were true

as very few collectors want to actually open up a computer we have developed a standard test to compare clock speeds in two otherwise identical computers
creatively named the " Standard Clock Speed Test" it involves setting both computers to the INFINITE level and then playing a move that takes the computer out of book..once accomplished we then let the computer ponder a move closely watching how long each computer takes to reach a given ply (I.E.5-6ply)
obviously in this case the Virtuoso should be searching 60% faster
however since neither of these computers will show the depth search we then must follow its intended move and watch when the intended move changes

the earlier computers can be made to leave book early on usually with 1.a4 or 1.h4
Left handed collectors prefer of course A4 while "Righty" collectors insist on h4

as i am a lefty i set both computers to INFINITE and then set them to thinking on this position:

STANDARD CLOCK SPEED TEST(LEFTY)
[fen]rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/P7/8/1PPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQkq a3 0 1[/fen]

the Capella here ponders 1.Nf6 for 4 seconds then switches to d5 for 25 seconds then g6 for 25 seconds and then back to d5.
the Virtuoso also ponders 1.Nf6 then d5 then g6 and then back to d5 ..all in the Same EXACT time

clearly the clock speeds are the same!

now i cant say for certain if they are both 16 Mhz or both 10 Mhz but i am guessing that the manual for the Virtuoso(16 Mhz) was a misprint and they are both 10

XXX Hardcore Collecting Regards
Steve

[Robert Weck]

Hi Steve,

the next smaller wooden board Saitek released was the Virtuoso in 1992 running on the H8 processor and with the manual indicating a 16 Mhz clock speed:


now it is believed by collectors worldwide that the Capella and Virtuoso are identical computers(even though released 6 years apart ) with only some small cosmetic differences .same program ,,and hardware and both programmed by Frans Morsch

however and herein was the problem..the Capella's manual indicated a clock speed of 10 Mhz!

this should be considered as the correct value; the Virtuoso's 16 MHz become divided by 2, which gives an actual 8 MHz. This makes more sense, as the V. beeing the older machine.

It is similar with some other computers with this program as the Mephisto Champion/Saitek TC (2080) (14 MHz -> 7 MHz)

You can compare the nodes/sec of the Saitek TC with the Miami (10 MHz) and the Miami has about 50% more; so it is very unlikely, that TC really runs with full 14 MHz!

For machines without a display, i suggest to set them to a fixed-depth level (when the computer plays its move, it should have reached the specified ply; is easier to handle than your method with infinite level) and play 1.f3 (don't know, if there is a big difference to 1.h4 or so)

With this, a 10 MHz machine should reach the 8th ply after ca. 45-49s, the 9th around 190-193s.

We did not have 8 MHz computers, but the 7 MHz TC (2080) did the same in 68s/272s.

This should give you an idea, what you could expect...

If you want to be sure, that your Capella and Virtuoso are really the same speed, you could do this easy test...

Maybe your Virtuoso was a late model, so that Saitek had speeded it up to the 10 MHz of its successor Capella and they did not change it in the manual.


best regards,
Robert

P.S.: The Novag Super Expert/Forte has the same divided CPU-speed; a 12 MHz crystal gives 6 MHz.

[Steve B]

Hi Steve,

the next smaller wooden board Saitek released was the Virtuoso in 1992 running on the H8 processor and with the manual indicating a 16 Mhz clock speed:


now it is believed by collectors worldwide that the Capella and Virtuoso are identical computers(even though released 6 years apart ) with only some small cosmetic differences .same program ,,and hardware and both programmed by Frans Morsch

however and herein was the problem..the Capella's manual indicated a clock speed of 10 Mhz!

this should be considered as the correct value; the Virtuoso's 16 MHz become divided by 2, which gives an actual 8 MHz. This makes more sense, as the V. beeing the older machine.

It is similar with some other computers with this program as the Mephisto Champion/Saitek TC (2080) (14 MHz -> 7 MHz)

You can compare the nodes/sec of the Saitek TC with the Miami (10 MHz) and the Miami has about 50% more; so it is very unlikely, that TC really runs with full 14 MHz!

For machines without a display, i suggest to set them to a fixed-depth level (when the computer plays its move, it should have reached the specified ply; is easier to handle than your method with infinite level) and play 1.f3 (don't know, if there is a big difference to 1.h4 or so)

With this, a 10 MHz machine should reach the 8th ply after ca. 45-49s, the 9th around 190-193s.

We did not have 8 MHz computers, but the 7 MHz TC (2080) did the same in 68s/272s.

This should give you an idea, what you could expect...

If you want to be sure, that your Capella and Virtuoso are really the same speed, you could do this easy test...

Maybe your Virtuoso was a late model, so that Saitek had speeded it up to the 10 MHz of its successor Capella and they did not change it in the manual.


best regards,
Robert

P.S.: The Novag Super Expert/Forte has the same divided CPU-speed; a 12 MHz crystal gives 6 MHz.

hi Robert

the lack of display was no problem
it is the fact that the computers do not offer information on depth search

i guess setting it to a fixed depth and waiting for a move can also work

i was also interested to see if the programs were the same and so watching it choose its moves(all the same ones) proved this point as well

i also verified the test with a3 and the moves/times were identical again

Certain Regards
Steve

[drbob]

I have a Fidelity Chess Challenger (3MHz!) that I still enjoying playing. That buzzie voice still announces, "I am Fidelity's Chess Challenger, your computer opponent."
Every once in a while, I can force it to say, "...And mate, I lose."
But, and I know it's impossible, sometimes I think I can hear it snickering at my moves. Really annoying.
Robert

[Steve B]

I have a Fidelity Chess Challenger (3MHz!) that I still enjoying playing. That buzzie voice still announces, "I am Fidelity's Chess Challenger, your computer opponent."
Every once in a while, I can force it to say, "...And mate, I lose."
But, and I know it's impossible, sometimes I think I can hear it snickering at my moves. Really annoying.
Robert

hi Robert

yes the world famous computer voice
the very first use of the voice chip in a chess computer
invented by the legendary Father of ALL commercial chess computer programmer's..Ron Nelson
and now there is a chart topping hit with the voice singing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_H6uIQPjvQ


Best
Steve

[drbob]

Hi Steve,
Thanks for the reply and the link. What a wacky video. Good thing I took all my antipsychotic medicines today. Barely kept me from being sucked into the screen.
Regards,
Robert

[Steve B]

Hi Steve,
Thanks for the reply and the link. What a wacky video. Good thing I took all my antipsychotic medicines today. Barely kept me from being sucked into the screen.
Regards,
Robert

actually Bob ,,and i am being serious here
that Video was sent to me personally by Ron Nelson
who was the man who INVENTED the first commercially available chess computer..the Fidelity Chess Challenger in 1977

he currently programs all of the chess computers for Excalibur Electronics which will soon be releasing the Phantom Force Robot:



programmed by Nelson and incorporating the largest voice vocabulary feature ever seen in a dedicated chess computer

May The Force Be With You Regards
Steve

[spacious_mind]

he currently programs all of the chess computers for Excalibur Electronics which will soon be releasing the Phantom Force Robot:



programmed by Nelson and incorporating the largest voice vocabulary feature ever seen in a dedicated chess computer

May The Force Be With You Regards
Steve

Steve:
Is this correct that every Excalibur is programmed by Ron Nelson? Do you happen to know which ones have exact same "Clone" software in the Excalibur range?

Thanks

[Steve B]

hi Nick

yes sir

every chess computer Excalibur releases is programmed by Nelson
of course Excalibur has sold some computers in the past that were clones of other computers

for Example the Karpov 2294 was really the Novag Emerald Classic Plus which of course was not programmed by Nelson

but with the odd exception aside that is the general rule

as far as current day clones of Nelson programs ..i am afraid i cant say with any degree of certainty..but i imagine there are not very many

Best
Steve

[spacious_mind]

hi Nick

yes sir

every chess computer Excalibur releases is programmed by Nelson
of course Excalibur has sold some computers in the past that were clones of other computers

for Example the Karpov 2294 was really the Novag Emerald Classic which of course was not programmed by Nelson

but with the odd exception aside that is the general rule

as far as current day clones of Nelson programs ..i am afraid i cant say with any degree of certainty..but i imagine there are not very many

Best
Steve

Hi Steve:

Yes I can also think of a few they sold earlier from another manufacturer including the Legend II and Accolade.

Pity, I was hoping you would share some clone information I have to say that they in most cases were clever in their different versions which makes it harder to exactly identfy a clone of a previous Model. For example the Kingmaster, I levels are set differently to II which again is different to III.

But a lot of the low end ones do follow a pattern with level 16, 48 or 25 as 30 sec settings. So I suspect a few but have not tested them yet for clones. Too busy playing tournaments at the moment.

Best regards

[Steve B]

The Novag Opal has the honorable distinction of being the smallest Pressure sensory chess computer ever released for sale
( the Fidelity Travel master is also quite small but it is somewhat bigger in width and in overall dimensions)

The Opal series consisted of four computers :
Opal(1992)
Opal II(1996)
Opal Plus(2000)
Star Opal(2005)

all four computers look exactly the same (except for color variations) and have the same exact keys and functions
the Opal had a 630 ply book and 16 levels of play while the other three all had 8500 ply books and 64 levels for the Opal II and 128 levels for the Plus and Star
in fact the manuals are all exactly the same(except for the level sections)

the Opal only had 4k-Rom and 256k Ram and the other three each had 16k and 768k
all four ran on a single chip processor at 8 Mhz

the only established rating for any of the Opals i could find is the Opal Plus at 1580 Elo(SS)

you can see all four computers here starting with this photo of the Opal
click on the " browse ->" to see all of the computers in the series

http://www.flickr.com/photos/10261668@N ... 922171918/

considering that all of the computers look the same and have the same manuals and features ..i suspected that they also all had the same program

if so .what we have here basically is a computer being released over and over for a period of 13 years with no difference at all except for the name on the computer and some more levels

testing my theory ..i fired up Mark Uniacke's Inaugural "Position of the Week"


[fen]rnb2rk1/ppp2pp1/8/4pPP1/1b1qP1n1/2PP2PN/P7/RN1QKB1R w KQ - 0 1[/fen]

it will be remembered that the best move is Qxg4 as was played in the game by Super GM Eduard Nemeth

i set each computer to the 2 minute per move level and let them have a go at the position

as i suspected ..the Opal II ,Opal Plus and Star Opal all played the same exact move Qd2(considering only this move for the full two minutes)

so it appears that they all have the same program even after 13 years

well..almost all..

the weakest computer of the group
the one with the least amount of ram,rom and levels

chose..yup you guessed it

Qxg4 Regards!
Steve

[Jose]

Hi Steve, hi all,

while the Corona is an auto-sensory with 81 leds(one on each square)

I think you mean 64 leds, or ?

Stratos/Corona/Simultano
Also the different program versions are interesting and like one them recognize, but for sure it is not easy.

I find the woodenborads and figures of Saitek very beautiful, more beautifully than many other woodenboards from some Top-Seller-Companies in the past...

More testing computers Regards José