DGT board and piece set arrive -- all issues resolved

This forum is for general discussions and questions, including Collectors Corner and anything to do with Computer chess.

Moderators: Harvey Williamson, Steve B, Watchman

Forum rules
This textbox is used to restore diagrams posted with the fen tag before the upgrade.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

DGT board and piece set arrive -- all issues resolved

Post by sje »

I'm pleased to report that the DGT board and the DGT Ebony piece set along with the DGT Windows software has all arrived in good shape and that everything works. While the process has taken longer than expected, Chess House has delivered and I'm completely satisfied with the end result with respect to all the DGT items.

From what I've seen, the difficulties were due to problems not with Chess House, but with DGT's US parts importer/distributor. I believe that these problems have since been fixed with the importer, but just in case any US buyer should check their piece set upon delivery.

--------

As part of the order, I also received a copy of Fritz 13 to help test the DGT board and piece set. Gosh, the interface is awful. Also, in the first few hours I found a display bug and an an audio bug. Oh, and a crash. Perhaps some of this was due to running a Windows 7 program under Windows 8. I don't know, and I'm not going to waste time trying to know. Further, I'm not going to waste time fiddling with the cursed Fritz 13 smorgasbord interface. The only good thing was that Fritz allowed me to test the DGT board and pieces under combat conditions.

More to come.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Post by sje »

After even more testing and examination, I have found only one very minor area of variance with the piece set. There are some pieces where there is a small departure from circularity with the cut of the felt pad on the base. Instead of being a true circle, the cut may be slightly elliptical or may have a small straight perimeter segment. There is no problem here, and I've seen the same in other high quality piece sets which were made by hand.

The felt pads are not thin billiard table cloth, but are instead made from a thicker, dark violet-color textile. The result is that the pieces may be made to slide easily and quietly on the very smooth board.

The sizes and shapes of the pieces are what is expected from the DGT site pictures, except that the knights are even better as you will see should you hold one in your hand.

If you're getting a Revelation II machine, then you'll see that the included DGT board is second to none. And if you specify the DGT Ebony piece set with your order, then your wallet might be a little thinner afterward but you'll have no regrets.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Post by sje »

After near continuous and mostly unattended operation, the DGT board continues to work as specified. I've been running long tests to see if static electricity charge accumulation could be a problem as it has been with some dedicated chess computers from the Old Days. Note: the atmospheric relative humidity is very low in the New Hampshire wintertime; it's easy to get sparks when I pet one of my cats. So far, there are no static electricity lock-up problems with the board.

--------

During one of the above long tests, I've been having Fritz 13 analyze the Fried Liver Attack which is:

1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 Bc4 Nf6 4 Ng5 d5 5 exd5 Nxd5 6 Nxf7 Kxf7 7 Qf3+ Ke6 8 Nc3 *

[fen]r1bq1b1r/ppp3pp/2n1k3/3np3/2B5/2N2Q2/PPPP1PPP/R1B1K2R b KQ - 3 8[/fen]
In the above position, Fritz suggests 8... Ncb4, but there's a problem here as there is no SAN move string "Ncb4". But there is the correct SAN move string "Nc4"; no file disambiguation is needed as the black knight at d5 is pinned and frozen in place. Likewise, there's no "Nce7" move, but there's a "Ne7" move. Hello ChessBase, please fix this.

--------

The DGT board comes with a drawstring bag for storing the chessmen. The bag is made from black fabric and has a spring leaded clasp for the cord, similar to which is seen on drawstrings for camping equipment. The bag has a stiff, elliptical bottom that will help keep the bag upright. Unlike the drawstring bags supplied by Novag with their machines, the DGT bag is plenty big enough to store all the pieces with room to spare. The DGT bag is okay, but the high quality and expensive piece set really deserves a nice box. I've got one on order from ChessUSA.

I don't know if the Revelation II will come with a drawstring bag for the pieces, and I don't know if a bag is included if pieces are ordered separately.

My mostly white color Cookie Cat is jealous of anything I spend time with instead of her, so she sat on the bag long enough to leave much hard-to-remove shedded white fur. She's done the same with my black chess tournament carrying bag, my black backpack, etc. After eleven years, I have given up on training her to behave better.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Serial number

Post by sje »

The DGT board can be probed via software to report its serial number, and my board is number 12,804. If the numbering began at one, then DGT has been selling an average of four boards per calendar day since they started production in 2004. That's a respectable total for an expensive luxury item, so it makes sense for chess software authors to support the board in their products.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Fritz vs Spooky Cat

Post by sje »

My shelter boy Spooky Cat can also be quite jealous of my chess activities. He's discovered that the DGT pieces are unweighted, and to him is an invitation to see how many he can remove from the board with a single swipe of his tail. The piece recognition capability of the DGT hardware aids much with recovery.

Fritz has not done as well with surviving feline frolic. I have Fritz running on an HP notebook connected to the DGT board. Spooky sees the notebook as just another cat toy and has concluded that its toasty, Spooky-sized keyboard was intended from the start as a warm napping place. Unsurprisingly, each Spooky cat-nap appears to activate half of Fritz's byzantine user interface functions leaving the program locked-up in a comatose state requiring a reboot.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

So, who has a DGT board?

Post by sje »

So, who has a DGT board?

Here, we have Steve B, Woody, myself, and maybe several whose names I don't recall offhand. Others?

I recall that a few of the TalkChess denizens have a DGT board. I remember Bob Hyatt as one of them; he used it for doing the DGT/Crafty interface. Bob said that the board would be much improved if it had per square LED indicators.

My guess is that anyone who plays a lot of non blitz chess on an Internet server could significantly benefit from a DGT board, but how many of these players have one?

Likewise, chess software authors would find a DGT board very useful for both OTB play and for setting up test positions.

If there were interest, a DGT board Users Group might be formed. Maybe on Facebook? This might be handy for software exchange and for sending feedback to DGT concerning future feature additions.
User avatar
Mars
Full Member
Posts: 694
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 9:48 pm
Location: Bonn, Germany

Re: So, who has a DGT board?

Post by Mars »

sje wrote:So, who has a DGT board?

Here, we have Steve B, Woody, myself, and maybe several whose names I don't recall offhand. Others?
I have one too. An old non-USB version. Somewhere in the attic... hmm... and there should be also... uhmm... a serial-usb adapter... somewhere... &%§&$ :oops:

Not Moving Houses Any Time Soon Again Regards,
Martin
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Re: So, who has a DGT board?

Post by sje »

Mars wrote:
sje wrote:So, who has a DGT board?

Here, we have Steve B, Woody, myself, and maybe several whose names I don't recall offhand. Others?
I have one too. An old non-USB version. Somewhere in the attic... hmm... and there should be also... uhmm... a serial-usb adapter... somewhere...
Probably any USB/serial converter will work; they likely all use the same FTDI chip. Here's the official DGT approved converter:
Image
http://digitalgametechnology.com/site/i ... -converter

I'm not sure why DGT continues to use the old RS-232 serial hardware in some of its products. The RS-422 differential signaling version used by Apple up until their USB switchover in 1997 was an improvement, but it still had problems. In an earlier life I spent too many hours designing, installing, and maintaining these old style communications; it was a blessing to see them all swept away in favor of USB and Ethernet.

DGT also has a wireless system for its serial boards, designed for events with up to a thousand DGT boards in use. You'll need deep pockets for this:
http://digitalgametechnology.com/site/i ... ssa-system
paulhuk
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:18 pm

Post by paulhuk »

Hi sje, I'm one of the anonymous few that also have a serial based DGT. I did try the piochess route for a while but ran into some intermittent glitches. As you know I'm getting the Rev II and so like Mars, mine will be consigned to the loft.

Mothballed regards,

Paul H
User avatar
compguy
Member
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:21 pm
Location: Greensboro, NC USA

Post by compguy »

I have a DGT Bluetooth board, royal pieces, XL clock and the carrying case. I mostly run Picochess with mine.

I agree with the statements that having move indicating LEDs would be super nice. Also wish the pieces had move weight to them. One would think I'm constantly resigning as many times as I knock down the king. :oops:
Mephisto Munich London 68020
Fidelity Mach III Master 6098
DGT Bluetooth eBoard
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Post by sje »

A common problem with using a basic RS-232 serial link is that without a decent error correction software layer, it's easy for a pair of machines to lose synchronization. One machine might send five bytes and the other might expect five bytes, but if one of the bytes is garbled and lost, the receiving machine might wait forever for something which never will come. Many, many times I've seen this.

It appears that the DGT XL clock could be susceptible to the above problem. The clock talks with the board using a three wire minimal serial link (receive, transmit, and signal ground). Have neither shielding nor differential signaling is an invitation for disrupting interference. As I understand, the same link is used to connect a DGT XL clock regardless of the DGT board model. The Revelation II is spared all of this as its clock is an emulation.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Post by sje »

compguy wrote:One would think I'm constantly resigning as many times as I knock down the king
I also have accidentally knocked over my DGT king (and queen) more than once. I have to be more careful, that's all. One issue here is that the DGT set is a full size set and a player has to sit at a certain minimal height above the board to best move the chessmen. I have a couple of club size (115 mm king) piece sets and the problem is more apparent with these. With my smaller ebony set (76 mm king) on a board with 38 mm squares, everything is within easy reach and I rarely knock over any pieces.

On the software side of things, I already have my program Symbolic ignore all illegal moves and positions. I'll have to add a bit of code to detect accidentally toppled DGT pieces which will emit the spoken warning "Move the pieces with your hand, not your elbow".
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Black from the bottom

Post by sje »

The DGT board automatically understands playing Black form the bottom of he board, a nice touch. Just set up the pieces and you're ready to go. If the particular board has rank digits/file letters on its side, these are ignored by the software.

Personally, I think that rank/file labeling is a distraction and is also unnecessary; that's why I ordered the a walnut board without any labeling.

Related: The world's fastest typists easily use keyboards where all the keys are blank.

Then there this one manufacturer who puts a big copy of the company's logo on square h1 of its chessboards. My own play is so poor that I can't allow needless distractions, so that imprimatur means a no sale of an otherwise fine board.
User avatar
sje
Full Member
Posts: 639
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 2:28 am
Location: Land of Snow, Mud, and Bugs, NH USA

Clock and bag

Post by sje »

Earlier today I sent an order for a DGT XL clock and a spiffy DGT carrying bag. The clock I'll use for experimentation and the bag I'll use for storage. They should arrive in a week or two. When the XL clock gets here, I'll get a RaspPi to start experimenting with PicoChess. As stated earlier, the main goal here is research towards making an open C++ DGT board interface for Mac OS/X and Linux.
User avatar
fourthirty
Full Member
Posts: 763
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:46 pm
Location: San Francisco

Re: Clock and bag

Post by fourthirty »

sje wrote:As stated earlier, the main goal here is research towards making an open C++ DGT board interface for Mac OS/X and Linux.
sje - Thank you for all the information that you have shared regarding your DGT board. I've been on the fence for about a year on this purchase, and your information convinced me to "take the plunge"!

I purchased the walnut board, timeless pieces, XL clock. I also plan to experiment w/ PicoChess on an MK802.

As a mac user, I'm looking forward to watching your progress on the interface!

Cheers,
Greg
Post Reply