COMING SOON: Match TM Portorose versus Mighty Hiarcs!!!!

Post by **Mark Uniacke** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 11:44 am

The first time Hiarcs met this beasty TM was at the first Computer Olympiad in London in 1989.

At the time H was running at 100 nodes per second on an Amiga 500 but received a whooping for its trouble. This time things might be a bit more equal...

I estimate H will be analysing about 750 positions per second, how many will the TM analyse per second?

spacious_mind · Post by **spacious_mind** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 11:49 am

Mark Uniacke wrote:The first time Hiarcs met this beasty TM was at the first Computer Olympiad in London in 1989.

At the time H was running at 100 nodes per second on an Amiga 500 but received a whooping for its trouble. This time things might be a bit more equal...

I estimate H will be analysing about 750 positions per second, how many will the TM analyse per second?

Phew I don't know, I am not sure that it shows you? I will take a look through the Info options to see if there is something that shows it.

ps.. I am more worried about poor Porto getting embarrassed

If it doesn't and its close then you would have done a fantastic job with your speed reduction.

Regards

Dave C · Post by **Dave C** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 11:50 am

Looking forward to Kibitzing.

Spectator...regards,
Dave

Post by **Harvey Williamson** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 12:52 pm

Game 1

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "1"]
[White "TM Portorose"]
[Black "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Result "0-1"]
[BlackElo "2271"]
[TimeControl "2400:1800@60"]
[WhiteElo "1600"]

1.d4 c6 2.c4 d5 3.Nc3 e6 4.e4 dxe4 5.Nxe4 Bb4+ 6.Nc3 Nf6 7.Bg5 c5 8.dxc5 Bxc3+ 9.bxc3 Qa5 10.Bxf6 gxf6 11.Qd4 e5 12.Qd2 Nc6 13.Rb1 Bg4 14.Rb5 Rd8 15.Bd3 Qa3 16.Rb3 Qa5 17.Rb5 Qa3 18.Rb3 Qxc5 19.Rb5 Qa3 20.Rd5 Ke7 21.Qc2 Be6 22.Rb5 Rd7 23.Ne2 Rhd8 24.Rb3 Qd6 25.Nc1 Bxc4 26.Bxc4 Qd1+ 27.Qxd1 Rxd1+ 28.Ke2 Rxh1 29.Rxb7+ Rd7 30.Rxd7+ Kxd7 31.Nb3 Rxh2 32.Kf3 Nd8 33.Kg3 Rh1 34.Bb5+ Kd6 35.Bd3 Ne6 36.c4 Rh5 37.Kf3 f5 38.Bb1 e4+ 39.Ke3 Ke5 40.g3 Rh3 41.Ke2 f4 42.g4 Rh1 43.Bc2 f3+ 44.Kd2 Rf1 45.Ke3 Re1+ 46.Kd2 Re2+ 0-1

Post by **Harvey Williamson** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 1:22 pm

Game 2

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "2"]
[White "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Black "TM Portorose"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2271"]
[TimeControl "1800:2400@60"]
[WhiteElo "2271"]

1.Nf3 Nf6 2.d4 b6 3.Bf4 Bb7 4.e3 e6 5.Nbd2 Be7 6.Bd3 Nh5 7.Bg3 O-O 8.Ng5 g6 9.Nxh7 Re8 10.Qg4 Ng7 11.Bxg6 fxg6 12.Qxg6 Nc6 13.Ne4 d6 14.Bf4 Rf8 15.Nhg5 Bxg5 16.Nxg5 Rf6 17.Qh7+ Kf8 18.Qh8+ Ke7 19.Qxg7+ Ke8 20.Nh7 Rf5 21.g4 Qe7 22.Qg6+ Qf7 23.gxf5 Qxg6 24.fxg6 1-0

Nick will be back for game 3 with an upgrade to the R30

blaubaer · Post by **blaubaer** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 1:30 pm

Hi,

Harvey Williamson wrote: Nick will be back for game 3 with an upgrade to the R30

upgrade from TM Portorose to R30? Never heard...

Confused regards,
Michael

Post by **Harvey Williamson** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 1:35 pm

Harvey Williamson wrote:Game 2

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "2"]
[White "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Black "TM Portorose"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2271"]
[TimeControl "1800:2400@60"]
[WhiteElo "2271"]

1.Nf3 Nf6 2.d4 b6 3.Bf4 Bb7 4.e3 e6 5.Nbd2 Be7 6.Bd3 Nh5 7.Bg3 O-O 8.Ng5 g6 9.Nxh7 Re8 10.Qg4 Ng7 11.Bxg6 fxg6 12.Qxg6 Nc6 13.Ne4 d6 14.Bf4 Rf8 15.Nhg5 Bxg5 16.Nxg5 Rf6 17.Qh7+ Kf8 18.Qh8+ Ke7 19.Qxg7+ Ke8 20.Nh7 Rf5 21.g4 Qe7 22.Qg6+ Qf7 23.gxf5 Qxg6 24.fxg6 1-0

Nick will be back for game 3 with an upgrade to the R30

I think 8...g6 was the blunder in the game.

Post by **Harvey Williamson** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 2:47 pm

Game 3 v R30 Gideon 1 more game to play I will lower Hiarcs elo to 2200

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "?"]
[White "R30"]
[Black "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Result "0-1"]
[BlackElo "2271"]
[TimeControl "2400:1800@60"]
[WhiteElo "1600"]

1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 c6 3.Nc3 d6 4.Nf3 Bf5 5.Bg5 Qb6 6.b3 Nbd7 7.Nh4 Be6 8.e4 h6 9.Be3 Qa5 10.Bd2 Qb6 11.d5 Bg4 12.f3 g5 13.fxg4 gxh4 14.Rc1 Ne5 15.h3 Bg7 16.Be2 O-O-O 17.dxc6 Nxc6 18.Rf1 Kb8 19.a3 Rhg8 20.Nd5 Qd4 21.Nxf6 Bxf6 22.Qc2 Bg5 23.Rd1 Qe5 24.Bxg5 hxg5 25.Qd3 f6 26.b4 Qh2 27.Qf3 Ne5 28.Qf2 Rc8 29.Rc1 Rc6 30.b5 Rc7 31.a4 Rgc8 32.a5 Rc5 33.Kd1 Nxc4 34.Bxc4 Rxc4 35.Rxc4 Rxc4 36.Qa2 Rd4+ 37.Kc1 Qg3 38.Qg8+ Kc7 39.b6+ axb6 40.axb6+ Kd7 41.Rf3 Qe1+ 0-1

spacious_mind · Post by **spacious_mind** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 2:48 pm

Harvey Williamson wrote:
Harvey Williamson wrote:Game 2

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "2"]
[White "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Black "TM Portorose"]
[Result "1-0"]
[BlackElo "2271"]
[TimeControl "1800:2400@60"]
[WhiteElo "2271"]

1.Nf3 Nf6 2.d4 b6 3.Bf4 Bb7 4.e3 e6 5.Nbd2 Be7 6.Bd3 Nh5 7.Bg3 O-O 8.Ng5 g6 9.Nxh7 Re8 10.Qg4 Ng7 11.Bxg6 fxg6 12.Qxg6 Nc6 13.Ne4 d6 14.Bf4 Rf8 15.Nhg5 Bxg5 16.Nxg5 Rf6 17.Qh7+ Kf8 18.Qh8+ Ke7 19.Qxg7+ Ke8 20.Nh7 Rf5 21.g4 Qe7 22.Qg6+ Qf7 23.gxf5 Qxg6 24.fxg6 1-0

Nick will be back for game 3 with an upgrade to the R30
I think 8...g6 was the blunder in the game.

Yes playing R30 Gideon. Hiarcs is too strong for TM Porto.

Post by **Mark Uniacke** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 3:59 pm

What was the clock speed of the 68030 in the TM machine?

I think the early ones were 36Mhz but later it was 50Mhz. Which one played here?

Post by **Harvey Williamson** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 3:59 pm

Game 4 a draw at 2200

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "?"]
[White "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Black "R30"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[BlackElo "1600"]
[ECO "B32"]
[TimeControl ""]
[WhiteElo "2200"]

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 e5 5.Nb5 a6 6.Nd6+ Bxd6 7.Qxd6 Qf6 8.Qd2 Nge7 9.Nc3 d6 10.b3 Bd7 11.Bd3 Nd4 12.Ba3 Qg6 13.f4 exf4 14.Qxf4 Rc8 15.Qf2 Rxc3 16.Qxd4 Qxg2 17.Rg1 Qxh2 18.Bxd6 Qh4+ 19.Kd2 Rc6 20.Qxg7 Rf8 21.Bg3 Qh5 22.Qe5 Qxe5 23.Bxe5 Rg6 24.Rh1 h6 25.Raf1 Nc6 26.Bf4 Rh8 27.Bc4 Rg2+ 28.Kc3 b5 29.Bd5 b4+ 30.Kb2 Rg6 31.Bd2 Rh7 32.e5 Rg4 33.Bf3 Rg3 34.Rh5 Rxf3 35.Rxf3 Bg4 36.Rf6 Bxh5 37.Rxc6 a5 38.e6 Bf3 39.Rc8+ Ke7 40.exf7 Rxf7 41.Rc5 a4 42.bxa4 h5 43.Rc4 Ke6 44.Bxb4 Rb7 45.a5 Kf5 46.a3 Be4 47.Rc5+ Kg4 48.a6 Rb6 49.a7 Ra6 50.Re5 Bf3 51.Re7 1/2-1/2

spacious_mind · Post by **spacious_mind** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 4:05 pm

Mark Uniacke wrote:What was the clock speed of the 68030 in the TM machine?

I think the early ones were 36Mhz but later it was 50Mhz. Which one played here?

HI Mark,

36 MHz it is the sold to the public version which I used. 50MHz were the actual Tournament versions Mephisto used for its competitions. I do have London, Vancouver and Lyon as well. Portorose is the weakest one of the four programs but the majority of the good dedicated computers I mentioned is what most people have so finding the sweetspot for Portorose to compete would mean that a lot of people could play their best programs against Hiarcs including Millennium Chess Genius.

Regards

Post by **Mark Uniacke** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 4:05 pm

I see from SSDF this entry:
223 Mephisto Portorose 68030 36 MHz 2140 43 -38 407 77% 1930

Which means 2271 was always going to be too strong for the Portorose.

This opponent looks better matched at that level:
189 R30 v. 2.5 2272 42 -38 343 69% 2135

Where would the Gideon version rank on the R30?

I found this on SSDF:
206 Chess Machine 30-32 MHz Schr?der 3.1 2208 28 -27 646 63% 2119

spacious_mind · Post by **spacious_mind** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 4:10 pm

Harvey Williamson wrote:Game 4 a draw at 2200

[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2015.11.21"]
[Round "?"]
[White "HIARCS 14 WCSC"]
[Black "R30"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[BlackElo "1600"]
[ECO "B32"]
[TimeControl "1800:2400@60"]
[WhiteElo "2200"]

1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 e5 5.Nb5 a6 6.Nd6+ Bxd6 7.Qxd6 Qf6 8.Qd2 Nge7 9.Nc3 d6 10.b3 Bd7 11.Bd3 Nd4 12.Ba3 Qg6 13.f4 exf4 14.Qxf4 Rc8 15.Qf2 Rxc3 16.Qxd4 Qxg2 17.Rg1 Qxh2 18.Bxd6 Qh4+ 19.Kd2 Rc6 20.Qxg7 Rf8 21.Bg3 Qh5 22.Qe5 Qxe5 23.Bxe5 Rg6 24.Rh1 h6 25.Raf1 Nc6 26.Bf4 Rh8 27.Bc4 Rg2+ 28.Kc3 b5 29.Bd5 b4+ 30.Kb2 Rg6 31.Bd2 Rh7 32.e5 Rg4 33.Bf3 Rg3 34.Rh5 Rxf3 35.Rxf3 Bg4 36.Rf6 Bxh5 37.Rxc6 a5 38.e6 Bf3 39.Rc8+ Ke7 40.exf7 Rxf7 41.Rc5 a4 42.bxa4 h5 43.Rc4 Ke6 44.Bxb4 Rb7 45.a5 Kf5 46.a3 Be4 47.Rc5+ Kg4 48.a6 Rb6 49.a7 Ra6 50.Re5 Bf3 51.Re7 1/2-1/2

Yes this last game was interesting for Dedicated Computers. It seems that at 2200 Hiarcs is still a very tough nut to crack but there is a chance as seen in the above game to hold your own.

For TM Porto I would guess maybe around 2100 is where Hiarcs needs to be. Which would mean at 2100 computers such as Atlanta, Risc 1 & 2, Risc 2500, Magellan etc would have a chance to compete.

Probably somewhere between 2100 to 2200 is the sweet spot.

But the games were fun Hiarcs is a lot of fun at these setting and plays interesting chess. No blunders so it has to beaten by good playing!

Best regards

spacious_mind · Post by **spacious_mind** » Sat Nov 21, 2015 4:12 pm

Mark Uniacke wrote:I see from SSDF this entry:
223 Mephisto Portorose 68030 36 MHz 2140 43 -38 407 77% 1930

Which means 2271 was always going to be too strong for the Portorose.

This opponent looks better matched at that level:
189 R30 v. 2.5 2272 42 -38 343 69% 2135

Where would the Gideon version rank on the R30?

I found this on SSDF:
206 Chess Machine 30-32 MHz Schr?der 3.1 2208 28 -27 646 63% 2119

R30 Gideon is around the same strength as King 2.54/2.2 R30. So it was a good test. Next time I will have Gideon ready for rematch and King ready as well.

Hopefully we can do this soon as I enjoyed it a lot.

PS the number of positions evaluated by R30 Gideon were somewhere between 7000 and 8000 positions per second.

regards