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YoYo's Fidelity Serial Number Theory
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:38 am    Post subject: YoYo's Fidelity Serial Number Theory Reply with quote

yoyo_chessboard wrote:
a question not directly linked to that topic:

collecting about 250 serial numbers via ebay and google image and from my proper fidelity boards, i have determined (or supposed to) that the fidelity numbering with 8 digits has the following structure :
YDDDSSSS
Y: last digit of year from 1980
DDD : day in the year from 1 till 365/366
SSSS: from 1 till 9999.

from 1981 till 1989 not any problem
i have problems for :
years 1980 the first year with 8 digit serial.
i can't directly sort what is from 1980 and what is from 1990 with the serial number.
of course as ten years is a big gap, the reference determine which is from 1980 and which is from 1990. the boards from 1980 didn't exist in 1990.

and years 1990/1991, beginning with 0. i can't really see which board is from 1990 and which is from 1991.

on your photos i see
92570022
year 1989, day : 257, somewhere in mid-september

and 00000034:
do you have any idea how the precise date of birth of that upgrade ?

i know there were boards previously with another numbering structure, from start of Fidelity till 1980.
they had less that 8 digits.

maybe i could create another topic for that question.
i don't know if i am the only one interested by the precise datation of boards.
regards.


Hi Yoyo,

Below is a list Fidelity Models with serial numbers. In parenthesis are the year when the model was thought to have come out.

Fidelity Chess Challenger Champion Sensory Voice (1981) = 13173267
Fidelity The Classic (1985) - 53263096
Fidelity Designer 1500 Chess Coach (1990) - 82396977
Fidelity Designer 2000 (1988) - 91021292
Fidelity Designer 2000 Display (1988) - 91954939
Fidelity Designer 2100 Display (1988) - 90250715
Fidelity Elite Avant Garde Mobile Master (1986) - 60388008
Fidelity Excel 68000 (Mach I) (1987) - 72542491
Fidelity Excel Display (1987) - 72754218
Fidelity The Excellence Model EP12 (1985) - 52637337
Fidelity Gambit Version 1 (1987) - 63608410
Fidelity Gambit Version 2 (1987) - 81412818
Fidelity Gambit Version 3 (1987) - 92558977
Fidelity Gambit Voice (1987) - 71212265
Fidelity Kishon Chesster Challenger (1990) - 00051999
Fidelity Little Chesster Challenger B (1992) - L104946
Fidelity Mach II “B” Version (1987) - 73036552
Fidelity Mach II “C+” L.A. Version (1988) - 80646187
Fidelity Mach III Master (1988) - 83541713
Fidelity Micro Chess Challenger 12 buttons (1991) - 216229
Fidelity Micro Chess Challenger (1991) 16 buttons - A164826
Fidelity Mini Chess Challenger (1989) - 171491 (not made by fidelity?)
Fidelity Par Excellence (1986) - 92558977
Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 6 (1982) - 22324005
Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 8 (1980) - 02981881
Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 9 (1982) - 21551611
Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 12 (1983) - 42654031
Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 12B (1984) - 61018361
Fidelity Septennial (1984) - 21935401
Fidelity Super “9” Sensory Chess Challenger (1982) - 32240896
Fidelity Super “9” Deluxe Sensory Chess Challenger (1984) - 40690429
Fidelity The Silver Bullet (1986) - 61575922
Fidelity Tiny Chess (1991) - T174480
Fidelity Travel Master Chess Challenger with Sensory Board (1991) - 156601
Fidelity U.S. Chess Federation Special Edition (1984) - 40691810
Fidelity Voice Excellence (1985) - 92544966
Fidelity Voice Sensory Chess Challenger (1981) - 02590283

Generally speaking your theory is spot on. And, it starts from around 1980 onwards as you can see from the Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 8 (1980) - 02981881.

There are some anomalies. ie Par Excellence thought to have come out in 1986. My model per your theory is from 1989. But it is possible that Fidelity on some models had second production runs. Septennial is another one. It was supposed to have come out in 1984. But the housing is pretty much the same as Chess Champion (1981). So the serial number indication for 1982 is possible as well.

ps.. it would require more people to share their serial numbers to get a better confirmation.

Interesting regards,

Nick
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yoyo_chessboard
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thank you spacious mind

i have collected serials from steve's photos on flickr (or something like that).
i have also collected your serials from your web site.

i will post this evening what i have collected and your help will be usefull for 1986 (at least).
that year 1986 , fidelity moved from a part of Miami to another one, changing postal code from 33178 to 33014 and you have two serial number that interest me.

i have a serial+ postal code from the 33178 in early 1986
i have a serial+ postal code 33014 from mid 1986
and you have two serial of 1986 between mines, IIRC something starting with 6140xxxx
what would be interesting is to have the postal code with the serial in order to build the chronology.

what is strange according to the postal code on serial labels :
the last adress of Fidelity is the first adress of Excalibur (IIRC : 33172 postal code).
i always supposed that they had different offices and that second started after the death of first.

for the boards that doesn't fit, according to other considerations, a simple way to have confirmation(s) :
on most IC there is a date like YYWW or WWYY (year and week on the componant)
so for the boards that you suspect to not respect 'my' theory if you open them you will see the date of aseembly which is at least the date of the most 'young' component.

i have verified my theory on my boards but i have too few (just less than 20 different fidelity boards owned or opened).

but i haven't found any logic for the first epoq of fidelity in chicago with serial with less than 8 digits.

and also the end (1991, 1992 ?) with serials with less than 8 digits

regards.
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Yoyo,

I am planning on continuing reorganizing my chess computers. As I get to Fidelity I will try and list for you.

Thanks
Nick
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yoyo_chessboard
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi spacious mind

may be it is a good idea to open your par excellence.
we could have a good surprise.
fidelity made many changes over the years without too advertising them.

i have seen at least two different variation of par excellence, in the couple PCB ID/ ROM ID

i also own two designer 2000 that differ in some components, one is an early designer 2000, second has been built later.

i also own two chesster that doesn't have the same ROMs, the second in date (the youngest) having a revised program and more data.
i also suspect that there are two versions of kishon chesster (the german speaking chesster).

i also recently bought on ebay an EP12 4 Mhz which had a ROM never seen before,
and the EP12/6080 i have bought have some variations in the ROM/PCB.
all what i have bought in coming from USA sellers.

so you could find in your par excellence a new ROM ID or PCB-ID as it seems that it is one of the latest par excellence.
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yoyo_chessboard
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi spacious_mind

in your list i see two other interesting serials:

Fidelity Designer 1500 Chess Coach (1990) - 82396977 you imagine that it is from 1990 and label could indicate that it is from 1988 .
a way to be sure is to open the board and see the date on IC.

Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 8 (1980) - 02981881
a way to be sure is to read the postal code on the serial label
is it from chicago or from miami (and which miami postal code in that case)

one confirmation : none of your serial has a DDD > 366 which is impossible date.
so it could fit.

this one is also interesting :
Fidelity Gambit Version 1 (1987) - 63608410
you think it is from 1987 and the label could tell us it has been finished in last days of 1986.

Fidelity Voice Excellence (1985) - 92544966
if you find in it any component between 1986 and 1989, that will proove that your particular board is younger that the first of that model

thanks for your help.
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yoyo_chessboard wrote:


Fidelity Sensory Chess Challenger 8 (1980) - 02981881
a way to be sure is to read the postal code on the serial label
is it from chicago or from miami (and which miami postal code in that case)

thanks for your help.


OK the ZIP 33178 Miami

Going to have to answer you 1 at a time when I get to them Smile

Best regards
Nick
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yoyo_chessboard wrote:

Fidelity Voice Excellence (1985) - 92544966
if you find in it any component between 1986 and 1989, that will proove that your particular board is younger that the first of that model

thanks for your help.


In the SCC8 storage box I had another Excellence Voice:

Fidelity Excellence Voice Model 6092



Serial # below:



So it looks like I have 1989 and 1987 versions.

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yoyo_chessboard
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fidelity had 4 different postal adresses :
the first
"FE_60639 - fidelity electronics
chicago 5245 W diversey AVE 60639"

the second :
"FE_33178- fidelity electronics
8800 NW 36th ST MIAMI FL 33178"

the third:
"FI_33014 fidelity international
13900 NW 58th ct - MIAMI FL 33014"

the forth:
"FE_33172 - fidelity electronics
8800 NW 23 rd Street MIAMI 33172"

as i don't know how to post a correctly formatted excel speadsheet i have made two files in xps format.

one with the fidelity boards that have serial numbers with 8 digits
one with other serials (non 8 digits)


http://www95.zippyshare.com/v/11oarKBU/file.html
http://www95.zippyshare.com/v/BqBFUmHS/file.html

8digits YDDDSSSS : Y year from 1980 , DDD day from 1er january SSSS serial

for 8 digits serials, i am confident for years 1981 till 1989, using the serial and the adress
to choose between 1980 and 1990/1991 (first digit =0) i have not found anything else than the postal code on the label that could help to find the real year.
but if that postal code helps to determine which board is from 1980 versus 1990/1991 i didn't find any trick to find how to sort the 1990/1991 boards

it is said that fidelity moved from chicago to miami at end of 1980/early 1981

for non 8 digits i really don't know how to have a more accurate date of shipping.

also in my files i have erased the owner:
the main sources were ebay, google image, steve photos, spacious_mind serials , berger's serials and mines.

some interesting points:
in 1986 fidelity moved from Miami 33178 to Miami 33014
somewhere between serial 61019749 and 61439519.
so between day 101 and day 143.
i dont know if somebody knows the real date of that move to confirm that point and i don't have any idea if it is a big move or just crossing the road.

also at the end of fidelity's life there is that avanti found on ebay:
avanti 6137 serial 3005 4 "FE_33172 - fidelity electronics
8800 NW 23 rd Street MIAMI 33172"
as if they moved another time.

all comments are welcome.
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is another Voice Excellence:



Also a 1987 unit. Based on your theory they must have been at least 35 days in production and it is possible that 113 Units were built in that 35 day period. If that were the case then they were built as needed based on orders they received from stores where they sold their units. As I really doubt that it would take 35 days to build 113 units. That would be like 3 or 4 per day. Or no wonder they were so expensive back then. That would make you go bust.

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yoyo_chessboard
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i understand what you try to say.
but if you look differently:
if i take only your 4 following serials:

7 254 4966
7 275 4218
7 289 5079
7 303 6552
think serial with "modulo 10000" in mind
when we reach 10000 we restart with 1.

may be between first serial and second there is 14 218-4966 boards produced =9252 modulo 10000 boards produced (9252, 19252, 29 252,...)
between the second and third it could be 15 079-14 218 = 861 modulo 10000
etc

so between your two excellence voice there are 5079-4966 = 113 boards modulo 10000.
in fact if we introduce the modulo 10000 we can explain all gaps.
i don't know how much was the fidelity production capability per month, but that fit can.
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is another 1982 Fidelity SC9.



Lower production quantity that week. If you look at the serial numbers and accept that the 2nd to 4th digits are the day stamp, from 1980 to 1988 it seems that Fidelity did their labelling every Friday only. Hence I would estimate the quantity amounts (last 4 digits) are for what they produced that week. Therefore what is unsure is if the quantity amount is a sequence for all models produced that week and not necessarily without some further serial checking. For example if labeled 5000 units that Friday at an average of say $100 then weekly your produced $500,000 worth of computers. Multiply that by 50 and you get $25,000,000 per year or half that if the average unit was worth $50 instead of $100 to Fidelity for chess computers. I would guess that sounds about right to me?

So Friday was labelling day most of the time from 1980 to 1988. In 1989 and 1990 you did have some where labelling day was also on a Tuesday and occasion some other day of the week.

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Last edited by spacious_mind on Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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spacious_mind
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yoyo_chessboard wrote:
i understand what you try to say.
but if you look differently:
if i take only your 4 following serials:

7 254 4966
7 275 4218
7 289 5079
7 303 6552
think serial with "modulo 10000" in mind
when we reach 10000 we restart with 1.

may be between first serial and second there is 14 218-4966 boards produced =9252 modulo 10000 boards produced (9252, 19252, 29 252,...)
between the second and third it could be 15 079-14 218 = 861 modulo 10000
etc

so between your two excellence voice there are 5079-4966 = 113 boards modulo 10000.
in fact if we introduce the modulo 10000 we can explain all gaps.
i don't know how much was the fidelity production capability per month, but that fit can.


Hi Yoyo,

Go and check the day of the week from 1980 to 1988 and you will see it is always a Friday. Even in my two examples above notice the difference is 35 days on one and 21 days on another again it means that they only labeled on Friday's.

This does change in 1989 and 1990 to some degree but that pattern seems consistent on the 20 or so I just checked between 1980 and 1988 from the serial numbers I listed. The last 4 digits is that Fridays labelling sequence.

Now the question was it every Friday that they labeled? Or was it week 1, 3 5 etc? We need more serial numbers !!!

ps... you can check the labelling day of the week here:

https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/custom.html?year=1982&country=1&cols=3&doy=1&df=1

Happy Friday! .... labelling and shipping day.. regards
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yoyo_chessboard
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think your theory about friday is good.

i verified many and there are very few exceptions.
and i looked at very high day number 360 and 364 , and they are last friday of their respective year.

so the serial number is YDDDSSSS with SSSS resetted every week ?

i find it better than my 'modulo 10000' theory, and it makes more sense for repairing also.
if they find a quality problem at the production stage, they can identify which serials are concerned by the problem.
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Tibono2
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,
my SC9 (sticker with unusual model# SU9) is 32381304.
Thus another Friday hit (1983, August 26th)
My Excellence 63183181 Friday, 1986, Nov. 14th. Bingo.
Tibono
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hi tibono2
according to the serial number i suppose that your excellence is a 6080

could you open your SC9 to see what is really inside ?
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